Catch the latest news on NBA Blog, a journal of hoops-related commentary, news and analysis, and reader-driven discussions.
3:30 p.m. ET, 1/17/07
Posted by Chris Mannix
Al Harrington should be a good fit in Warriors coach Don Nelson's small-ball offense.
Ron Hoskins/NBAE via Getty Images
More often than not, the best trades are the ones that don't happen. Unless, of course, you are talking about two teams desperate to shake things up.
The eight-player trade between the Warriors and the Pacers was a case of both teams feeling their current formulas had taken them as far as they could go. So Golden State dealt Troy Murphy, Mike Dunleavy, Ike Diogu and Keith McLeod to Indiana for Al Harrington, Stephen Jackson, Sarunas Jasikevicius and Josh Powell.
But at the end of the day, who does this deal really help? Warriors coach Don Nelson, never at a loss for words, has been upset at the performance of his veteran players of late and frequently focused his wrath on Dunleavy and, to a lesser extent, Murphy, a Warrior for his entire six-year career. In Al Harrington, the Warriors get a player tailor-made for Nellie-ball (which is why they pursued him so rigorously in the offseason). Harrington is a stronger, more athletic version of Dunleavy, a versatile small forward capable of shifting to three positions and scoring -- always a key for Nelson -- inside and out.
Though Jackson and Jasikevicius (whom Nelson's son, Donnie, coached in Lithuania) are one-dimensional, they can fill up the basket and will get plenty of opportunities in the Warriors' free-wheeling offense. None of the acquired players, however, addresses the Warriors' porous defense (NBA-worst 106.6 points per game), meaning once again a Don Nelson-coached team will need to overwhelm opponents offensively to win games.
For Indiana, this deal was about making Jermaine O'Neal happy. After being on the cusp of the NBA Finals three years ago, O'Neal was witnessing a slow deterioration of the talent around him and had been giving voice to his concerns. Though this trade may appease O'Neal in the short term, neither Murphy or Dunleavy is the physical post presence O'Neal has been pining for since Brad Miller skipped town.
The wild card in this is Diogu, a supremely talented (if undersized) power forward who is strong around the basket (53 percent from the field) and at the free throw line (79.5 percent). If he can prove to be a capable rebounder (3.7 rebounds per game in just 13.1 minutes), Indiana could plug him in next to O'Neal and occasionally match him up with some of the more physical centers, saving O'Neal from further wear and tear. It's what the Pacers have been trying to get from Jeff Foster, who has a nose for the ball but is not the offensive threat Diogu could prove to be.
What do you think? Who got the best of the trade? Are the Pacers better after trading two starters? Are the Warriors good enough to make the playoffs in the rugged West?
Harrington is the best player in the trade and usually that means the Warriors got the best of the trade. He shows good offensive skills, I just hope Nellie had get him to do the little things too. I like Jas..... he's nice with the ball.
Sorry to see Dunleavy go because he does the little things well, but sadly his failure to take advantage of smaller players defending him was his shortcoming. Murphy is a nice jump shooter, but that's it; he's got nice rebounding numbers but never seemed to get those key rebounds in traffic.
I think the Pacers got the better players in the deal. The only valuable player that the Warriors got was Harrington. Murphy, Dunleavy, and Diogu all showed that they can contribute on a somewhat consistent basis. Jackson has been nothing but a headache for the Pacers and shouldn't even be starting for an NBA team.
Golden State got the best of this deal. They will get some much needed offensive power. They can't get any worse than they already are on defense. The Pacers however get an average player in Murphy and a below average player (considering his draft status and current and future salary) in Dunleavy. The only light at the end of the tunnel for them in this trade is Diogu.
Jackson and Harrington are a great fit for Nelson's offense. Dunleavy and Murphy havent contributed this year one bit, and Diogu, even though I think will be a stud elsewhere, didn't fit into our offense.
I cant wait...and yes, this will be the year the warriors will make the playoffs...they are a much better team now.
Trading two starters for a bunch of bench players?.. i'd say the Warriors got the better of the deal. Indiana just wanted to get rid of Jackson. they did but with a huge prize. they recieved two dissapointing players w/ a very high contract that has been locked long term. The only consolation in this deal for them would be ike. so pacers fans pray hard that he can live up to his potential and not end up like these two ex warriors. -yo!-
This is a huge deal for Golden State and a head scratcher for Indiana. The Warriors rid themselves of dead weight in four players who were almost useless this season for a potential All Star in Harrington, a sharpshooter in Jackson, and Sarunus J. could be a great back up PG in Nellieball. I love this deal for the Warriors. There is only one explanation....Chris Mullin must have dirty pictures of Larry Bird in his drawer.
Obviously, the Warriors made the right move. They got rid of Dunleavy, who has been terrible since he signed the huge contract, and Murphy, who isn't fit for Nellie-Ball. In return they get a stud out of Harrington, a scorer in Jackson, and another point guard to shore up the lack of depth in the backcourt.
With no doubt, Warriors got the better end of this deal.
Good trade for both side, Murphy and Dunleavy are solid players, they just do not fit in at all with what Don Nelson is doing in Golden State. Meanwhile, Indiana gets a solid shooter in Dunleavy, a strong low post precense in Diogu and a solid rebounder in Murphy. GS did well by getting Harrington (who could really blow up for some big numbers in a Don Nelson run offense) and some more shooters. No team should really want to have Steven Jackson in your locker room (Jackson = poison), but he's got talent. Good trade for both teams really.
Indiana must have really wanted to ship Jackson's armory out of town, because it's getting a couple of stiffs in Murphy and Dunleavy. Harrington should help the Warriors, but they're still not a playoff team.
As a Pacer fan here in Indy, this trade is going to infuriate the fan base...especially after reading how BAD most all of these former Warrior players have been in the eyes of Coach Nelson. The Pacers can't hardly give away tickets this season, and for the life of me, I can't see how this is going to help. If O'Neal has the kind of clout that can get 1/3 of the roster traded, maybe he needs Bird's job. Larry showed us all that he knows how to play the game, but why on earth does anyone believe he can manage a ballclub?
Dunleavy is worthless, and is making a crapload of money for the next 5 years. Unloading him is a huge plus for the Warriors. The downside is that you have to deal with Steven Jackson, but I think it's worth it. Murphy has been OK, but can't stay healthy, and only plays on one end of the floor. The Warriors got the best player in the deal, Harrington, and cleared a ton of future cap space. They win the deal.
I dont think any of these teams will make the playoffs, but down the road i think Indiana got the better players , im a big Ike Diogu fan i think given if they give him minutes he could be a solid starter for them , also Murphy, and Dunleavy are nice players, but ultimately the key here is Ike Diogu.
As a Warriors' fan, I have mixed feelings about this deal. Assuredly, Murphy and Dunleavy are both overpaid, and both under-achieving. However, I hate to see Diogu sent packing. He could be a real "beast in the East" and Mullin may regret dealing him. Additionally, Jackson has been a "problem child" wherever he has played.
As an lifetime Pacers fan, I can't be any happier to see Jackson leaving town. I was always a Harrington fan, but he's such a poor rebounder that it doesn't hurt quite as much. I'm not sure that things will get markedly better anytime soon, but the chemistry and overall class of the team should improve immediately. Now, any takers for Jamal Tinsley?
Ike Diogu is going to be a real key player in this trade. Think about pairing him with O'Neal down in the post. In the east, that should win you some games. Murphy and Dunleavy won't be featured too much because of their weak defenses. Pacers now have a better chance to be in the playoffs: better shooters in the bench, and a player who is going to be a force in the post.
As for Golden State, they got veteren players who fit the style of play for Don Nelson. However, their attempt to "play like Phenoix Sun" will fail simply because they have Davis, not Nash. They become better, but still no playoffs in the west.
I dont think we've seen such flip flop'n since John Kerry was running for president. Since the post Reggie Miller era has begun the Pacer oranization has completely unraveled. The handling of the Artest deal, spending three 2nd round picks on James White (who was cut), and of late wasting a 1st round pick and salary bonus on Harrington.
The team seems desperate to try and make an excellent team out of refugee NBA players when the team should trade out players for picks and salary cap relief. Ultimately the team needs to just throw in the towel and rebuild the franchise. Until Bird and Walsh are gone so will this team be.
Anybody who thinks Indiana didn't get fleeced hasn't seen the Warriors play a whole lot. Dunleavy and Murphy are not only mediocre on their best nights, they also represent the two worst contracts in this deal. 5 years on both, $7.5 for Mikey, $8.2 for Murph. I honestly can't believe they took these two stiffs.
And Diogu is not much of a wild card. He's a short post player who consistently gets shots in the post thrown back. Great guy but he is Danny Fortson without the booty.
The Pacers definitely got the better end of the deal. Stephen Jackson was horrible on and off the court, and Al Harrington is a selfish forward who plays no defense. In Troy Murphy and Mike Dunleavy the Pacers received two smart players who wont cause trouble. The Pacers still need to make another move, but when they do Murphy and Dunleavy will fit perfectly into what they want to do. Getting rid of Jackson was a MAJOR plus for the Pacers.
Warriors win big time. Murphy, Dunleavy and Diogu were all riding the bench anyway. Players with minimum contracts have been playing better than them. Diogu is too short and can't stay healthy anyway. Look for big numbers from Harrington. Now the Warriors just need to trade Jason Richardson.
i'm a huge warriors fan, and i'm happy with the trade. i wish we could have used diogu more in our system, because he was a STUD in pac-10 play, but i'm glad to get rid of murphy and dunleavy's crazy contracts. i hope mullin learns from his mistakes, and gives big contracts to worthy players. i'm excited to see what Nellie does with these uptempo guys, even though nobody plays a lick of defense... Go Warriors!
this is no blockbuster trade. this is "our problems" for "your problems". 4 of the 8 players are overpaid until the year 2010. this will no keep jermaine o'neal happy. this will not kepp don nelson happy. and most importantly, this does not keep me interested in either team this year.
The current talent level definitely seems to favor Golden State, but I question if they got any real upgrades to Matt Barnes, Mickael Pietrus, and Monta Ellis. My belief is no. But Indiana had better hope Ike Diogu starts putting up Barkley numbers if it wants to justify taking on the huge contracts of a couple stiffs like Troy Murphy and Junior Dunleavy.
I think this is a trade for the sake of making a trade... which is never good. I think Golden State clearly got the better end of this with Al Harrington. The piece lost in all this is the fact Indiana has hamstrung themselves with two bloated, long-term contracts for average role players. This deal seems to me the nail in the coffin for Bird/Walsh in Indiana.
Indy is underestimated on this deal. They received two high-IQ players, if unathletic. They should fit in better with Rick Carlisle's system. What this doesn't address is Indy's suspect backcourt. Tinsley is still the answer at the 1.
Interesting deal for both. Golden State benefits from having Harrington, who fits the run and gun style of Nellie, as well as regaining a 2 guard who is at least capable of scoring at a good clip. This helps them offset the injury to JRich and potentially opens up another door to trade him. Could end up being VERY beneficial to the warriors in the end, with the ability to get rid of some serious contracts and get some quality in return. Stephen J is no JRich, but at least he's a capable starter.
As far as Indiana goes, I think they have to be pretty happy right now. Murphy's a good double double guy, capable of drawing out some defenses with his outside shooting, thus opening the paint for O'Neal. And they have a very good backup center/PF now in Diogu, who has a lot of upside. Dunleavy will fit into Indianapolis' system better than the run/gun style of nellie, because they are mainly a post up/kick out team, and that suits his style of play.
All in all, it's a good trade for both teams, who both needed new life. However, I can't wait to see Jrich, BD, and Al running together with Pietrus and Biedrins.
The west just got better.....as if it wasn't already the best conference..
This move will cataspult the Warriors into the playoffs, come on Minnesota, no way. Not enough talent to compepte with GS. Utah has begun to drop and will continue with the low-level play of AK-47. Lost 4 of the last 5. If you know basketball, not watch like most this was hugh move in GS favor.
I also agree that the Pacers were the clear winners in this trade. They acquired young, talented players that needed a change of scenery. On the other hand, I don't like the fact that that trouble-making, trash talkin Stephen Jackson has to come over and pollute the waters of the Bay Area. I say, if he does screw-up, cut him off the team and leave him on Alcatraz with nothing more than a can of corned-beef and let him try to swim back to shore in the shark-infested waters. Baron Davis runs this show and the last thing we need is a distraction and possible short-fuse that will butt heads with Baron and Nelly. I wonder how he is going to get along with JRich when he does come back. Al Harrington is, on the other hand, a starting point to the puzzle. And yes, traditionally, the Warriors only way to win is to light-up their opponent to make-up for a lack in defense. Basketball is more fun to watch that way. I wonder if they'll bring back the "free slice of pizza" at the Colliseum whenever the Warriors score more than 100 pts in a game.
I'm never liking giving up talented young players in a trade, but Harrington for Diogu is a very good one for the Warriors. With Murphy out of the picture then you have a starting five when all are healthy of Davis and J-Rich at the guard slots, Pietrus and Harrington at forward with Biedrins at center. Of the three talented young players the Warriors had I was more than willing to accept the trade of Diogu instead of Biedrins and Ellis.
i think warriors will get an upgrade from baby Al, who is better offensively and defensively than dunleavy, but other than that, i think pacers have the better deal, they are able to get troy murphy playing centre, to complement o'neal, the jewel in the deal is actually diogu, he is short for a power forward, but i seen him play, he hussles and he play hard, just look at his stats in just little minutes, imagine him playing double digits if given an opportunity, if dunleavy doesn't work at SF, i am not suprise to see diogu at SF, o'neal at PF and murphy at Centre, with the weaker eastern conference, they can win a few more games to get a higher ranking in the playoff.
Warriors got a good guy whom they really wanted and who should fit there system (Harrington). Saras should fit there system much better than he fitted into Indiana’s game. They got rid of two players which didn’t fit. So, from there point of view the only bad thing is Jackson’s behavioral problems (from basketball point of view he should fit into there running game just fine). So it’s probably a win for Warriors. It’s kind of strange move for Indiana. They unloaded Jackson which is a huge thing for them. But other than that it doesn’t look like that got something which will help them. Also, they’ve got only five players from last year left. This wouldn’t help there game either. So unless it’s a setup for some other block-buster trade – Indiana probably is loosing here.
I don't understand why Indiana pursued Al Harrington all summer and now after 38 games is dealing him to Golden State. I'm a season ticket holder and this makes me madder than hell. The Pacers needed time to get their chemistry figured out, instead Bird decides to shake them up again. I especially don't like the fact that they traded Sarunas Jaskikevicius. I know Stephen Jackson has been a pain, but I could deal with him. But Al Harrington is a big mystery to me. He and Jermaine are supposed best friends and Al was so happy to be back in Indianapolis where his family lives. I just don't get it. Can somebody analyze this and help me figure why.
The salaries of Murphy, Dunleavy, Jackson, and Harrington, show what is wrong with professional sports today. It is a slap in the face to fans that guys like these should earn these kind of salaries. As long as we the fans, continue to spend $100 a seat to attend these sporting events we have no one to blame.
Murphy and Harrington are solid players, Diogu has lots of potential. I think Nellie will use Harrington to make the Warriors into a playoff team, with no chance of ever winning beyond the first two rounds. Diogu should compliment Jermaine and in turn will make Ike into a solid starter.
As for me, I will continue to watch college hoops and wish for days gone by when the NBA was about teams and familar faces.
Murphy, Diogu and Dunleavy all are going to be very good players in the leastern conference. None of them could stand up to western conference forwards. So, pacers will make and continue to make playoffs for years with this player and Diogu could become an all star in eastern conference.
That said warriors got better of deal, just because of Harrington and Sasu and might even make playoffs this year. They also freed up money in years to come so could sign Monta and Biedrius for long term contracts. But my guess is warriors are not done dealing, they might still look to trade stephen jackson/adonal foyle
The Warriors really wanted two things: (1) Harrington and; (2) to dump salary. They need an athletic and versatile scorer like Harrington and they needed to dump salary to sign Biedrins, Barnes, Ellis, and Pietrus next year. I suspect that they will trade Jackson if he acts up (only after Richardson and Pietrus get healthy). But Dunleavy is terrible and Murphy shoots (and misses) too much form the outside (and has no inside game). Diogu can play.
The Bottom line is this: No one knows who got the better end of the deal except for two people, Donnie Walsh and Larry Bird. These are the same people who pulled off the Dale Davis for Jermaine O'Neal trade and the Jalen Rose for Ron Artest and Brad Miller trade. At the time, both of those trades were viewed as even, or even tilted against the Pacers, and look how those turned out. All I know is what I see, and as a Pacer fan, I've seen Walsh and Bird get the better half of nearly every trade they haven't been forced into (see Ron Artest for Peja). At the very least, this adds a little excitement into otherwise stagnet seasons in Indy and GS.
I think both teams did well here. They both got players, overall, who fit their systems better. Indy will miss Harrington, that's for certain, but I think Diogu's going to be averaging 15 and 10 by the end of the season. Murphy and Dunleavy are players who will play their roles well and help stabilize the Pacers. It may not be hugely popular in Indy, but I think it was a wise move.
As a Golden State Warrior fan, I am absolutely elated with this deal. In matter of fact, I'm in shock Chris Mullin was able to find a team to dump Murphy AND Dunleavy on. I realize S.Jackson has his baggage but this was a no-brainer for Golden State. They not only managed to upgrade the talent level on their roster, but they also acquired much needed cap relief, which will be needed to extend the contracts of Monta Ellis and Andris Biedrins. Of all the 4 Warrior players to head east to Indy, I'm probably most dissapointed to see Ike Diogu go. In the right system and with the right teammates around him, he can be a very productive NBA player. Troy Murphy has his strengths but his weaknesses prevented him from getting any significant burn in Don Nelson's up tempo offense. He's too slow and can't play defense to save his life. As for Dunleavy, this guy is a fraud plain and simple. I've watched most of the Warriors games the past few years and I honestly can't recall one big shot Dunleavy has ever made. Not one. He does have good court vision and can handle the ball, but he can't shoot, can't create a shot for himself, and is a worse defender than Troy Murphy (if possible). Chris Mullin must have mindtricked Larry Bird on this one.
Harrington doesn't play defense and is just one dimensional. Doesn't know how to rebound.
Jackson can't hit the side of a barn, so much for being a "sharpshooter". You guys in Golden State will find he talks a great game but really should be out of the league. He loves to pose after each shot, doesn't know the meaning of defense. Get ready to hear how he knows how to win championships from his major contributions in San Antonio. Ask yourself the question if he is so good, then why did San Anton, Atlanta and now Indy want to get rid of him so quickly.
Sharonus is too slow for NBA ball, he will drive you crazy getting beat off the ball, not a reliable 3 point shooter either, I guess the 3 point line in Europe and Israel must only be 20 feet from the basket.
To paraphrase an "American Idol' contestant a few years back..."HERCULES!!! HERCULES!!!"
The stunner-shades move was involving Ike Diogu in the mix. I guess he was added so Larry Bird doesn't get lynched by the Pacer fans.
As for the Lithuanian kid, Sarunas Jasikevicius, don't forget that Warriors had another good shooter named Sarunas in their franchise...A fellow Lithuanian named Sarunas Marciulionis who was coached by Don Nelson.
In the short term, GS got the slightly better end of this deal. It won't matter though, they still aren't a playoff quality team. Indy stayed about the same for now, but Murphy is a better fit at the 4 than Harrington, since he can actually rebound. Diogu is the key, easily the best player in this deal. I can't believe the Warriors dumped him for about as minor an upgrade as you can get. In 5 years, when the Warriors non-playoff streak is 5 years longer than it is right now, everyone will be killing Mullin for giving up a borderline all-star PF for junk.
ok this is coming from a die hard warriors fan. Dunleavy was a HORRIBLE player during his time with the Warriors. he was not good at any one thing. Murphy was average at best. Diogue I had really high hopes for, but he did not fit in very well with the team, so no loss there. Harrington will be very good with the team I think. We will see about Stephen Jackson. Remeber, if worst comes to worst, they can always cut him.
As a Pacers fan, this trade just leaves me with questions. Do you think Mullin drove Murphy and Dunleavy to the airport himself? Why on earth would the Pacers agree to take on those contracts? Does Bird realize that there is a salary cap? Why not just waive Stephen Jackson? Is there some sort of contest to see which old Celtic (Ainge, Bird, McHale) can run a franchise into the ground first?
Nellie said it best "Dunleavy would be better in a situation where he is surrounded by a lot of good players because he is a blend player"
I have said 1000 times..the kids from Duke would be better off being drafted at the end of the 1st round where they can play for teams that already have talent. Because at the top of the 1st round you are expected to come in and be THE difference maker..and the majority of them are not. For the most part..the Dukies just lead you back to the lottery evey year as opposed to the playoffs
The Pacers' biggest weakness this season has been inconsistency. At the heart of that inconsistency have been 3 of the players they dealt away: Harrington, Jackson, and Jasikevicius. Yes, Jasikevicius was a great player overseas, but it just seems that his game doesn't translate well to the NBA... it would appear that he can't handle the superior defenses, so his only asset- his shooting- has been largely irrelevant. So I consider him a non-factor in the trade, from the Pacers' perspective. Although Nellie will love his disregard for defense, so look for him to get decent minutes and maybe shoot himself out of his career-long slump (40.2% from the field).
Jackson and Dunleavy seem to be about an even swap. Both are perimeter players whom their teams wanted to get rid of, and that has been accomplished. Jackson has been a headache and is a maddeningly inconsistent shooter, while Dunleavy is an underachiever with a high price tag.
McLeod and Powell are throw-ins. I've never even heard of McLeod, while Powell was the 12th man on the bench for the Pacers.
So... that leaves the trade as essentially Diogu and Murphy for Harrington. Golden State will get better in the short run, obviously. But including Diogu in the trade could turn into yet another steal for Donnie Walsh. Also, Murphy will likely return to his double-double form of the past few years, now that he doesn't have to deal with Nellie's crap. That should lessen the pain of the loss of Harrington while Diogu finishes his development.
Short run: Warriors win Long run: Pacers win (although it'll be hard to wait)
I think the Pacers got the better deal. The only good player I see for the Warriors is Harrington.Jackson is a head case that was a distraction on and off the court. Murphy and Dunleavy are not that great either but there are hard workers and will put the numbers to put Indiana in pace for a playoff berth, after all they are in the Eastern conference now,in Diogu I see the next Diaw.
All I can say is ... Donnie Walsh did it again. He got two players that just needed a change of scenery (Dunleavy and Murphy), a promising big man with upside (Diogu), AT THE SAME time get rid of a locker room cancer (Jackson), who's contract they've wanted to get rid of. I do agree that Harrington is the best player and a good fit in Nellie's system, but I give kudos to Indiana...now if only they can upgrade Tinsley's spot.
Indiana got the better deal. It's not just who you trade away and what you get, it's what you have on your bench. O'Neal needs shooters and set up men. Dunleavy, for all his shortcomings can do both--I think he was feeling too much pressure in Oakland. Murphy is definitely a smooth shooter for a big man and must be guarded which leaves room for O'Neal to operate. Granger and some others on the bench need playing time and that made Harrington expendable. Jackson was done in Indiana and with recent track record was not an easy player to move.
Al Harrington has the most potential to impact a team, but Warriors have no depth at big forward and center. Pacers now have logjam at forward position - none of which can probably fill need for more dominant center. Pacers also now lack depth at guard. Trade will not improve either team enough to change standings.
After reading comments from both Golden State and Indiana fans, it appears the real keys to this deal aren't the biggest names after all.
Golden State fans aren't saying much about the two former starters and rave about Ike Diogu, while Larry Bird didn't want to deal Sarunas Jasikevicius.
It's obvious Harrington is a huge plus for the Warriors, while Jack will be an unknown entity with a fresh start in a crowded backcourt. If Jasikevicius can earn any time, his flashy offense could prove to be a very valuable commodity for Golden State, since it doesn't feature much defense anyway.
The obvious for the Pacers is that Murphy complements O'Neal better than what Harrington did. But, in the future, Diogu could turn out to be a beast as a rebounding 3.
It appears the real key to this deal does not revolve around the big names after all.
While Golden State fans provide lukewarm feedback for Murphy and Dunleavy, they rave about Diogu.
Much can be said for Pacer fans, who are saddened by the jettison of Sarunas Jasikevicius.
While it's obvious (or should be) what Harrington provides the Warriors with offensively, Jackson is a shoot-first entity with a fresh start in a very crowded backcourt. There just does not appear to be enough traditional NBA leather to go around.
Murphy will do what Harrington was unable to with the Pacers: complement the franchise player. It remains to be seen exactly how Dunleavy will figure into the rotation either as a starter or to bring immediate help off the bench. Diogu, when healthy, figures to provide the Pacers with a much bigger lineup. Instead of playing as an undersized 5, he may better suit the team as rebounding 3.
Overall Analysis: Decent trade for both squads. Golden State may look smart in the short term with some monster numbers from Harrington, while the Pacers will benefit most when the postseason rolls around.
The trade is fair, no major superstars just average players in the deal.
Although Harrington can play, Jackson is a headcase, who is average at best. The lituanian is alright, but wont spell Baron Davis at point guard, Powell is a free throw-in who wont see the court in Golden State.
Murphy is a good rebouder and dunleavy is fundamental who needed a change, the real key to this trade is Diogu, i think he can turn out to be a 18Pt 8-10 rbs guy in this league for years and if he grows up fast, he'll make this trade favour Indiana big time.
As a Pacers fan I think we got the best of the deal. Harrington was loved, but wasn't fitting in with our system and wasn't rebounding well. We get 3 guys that can rebound, 2 that can shoot, and one w/ great potential. We unloaded ONE GIANT headache. Look for the Pacers now to move Dunleavy back to the West Coast and his father for Maggette and possibly move Tinsley and others to the soon to be Brooklynn Nets for Kidd. Jamaal is from Brooklynn and would love to play there and NJ is looking to move Kidd. Bird and Walsh know what they're doing, sit back, relax and enjoy the season. GO COLTS
As far as the players involved go, I think it benefits Dunleavy & Murphy most since they were mentally scarred by Nelson. However, the Pacers just got even more boring. Please don't put them on tv! Outside of Granger, do they have anybody who can function on a fast break? Is Dunleavy tough enough to hang in the east?
With Golden State, you gotta give Don Nelson props for not straying from his game plan of the last 30 years. Like the Grizzlies, they'll be fun to watch but won't win anything of significance.
I understand wanting to make the playoffs for the first time since the early 90s, but if you're going to be swept in the first round (like the Warriors will) aren't you better off tanking and getting a higher draft pick, especially in a talent-rich year like this one?
Jackson only looks good to Golden State until he antagonizes his team mates and/or his trial goes against him and he gets jail time. Indiana is not known as a state with 'lenient' judges and juries, even if the defendant is a sports star. So GS fans, don't expect he will get off scot-free at his trial next month.
Better for both teams. I give the edge to Indy. Dunleavy NEVER was a good fit in GS, and before GS went so "up-tempo", Murphy was a total stud. Indy ball is perfect for Murphy, and Dunleavy will finally have the chance to blossom. Also, Diogu is a sweet pick-up. Indy will be all over the boards with J.O, Murphy, Foster and Diogu. Though Jackson and Al are indeed stronger and more athletic, I think Murphy and Dunleavy are smarter and less selfish players who remind me of old school, more fundamentally sound players from Larry's era.
Al will be great with GS, but I trust Indy's unique style of play more than GS's who will be SO terrible on the defensive end, and probably not good enough to out-run and out-score most western teams on a regular basis.
I think the Pacers won here. They got Diogu and Murphy who are a nice fit for them, they got rid of Jackson who was a nuisance. Dunleavy is one of these guys I'm starting to think will always be on the cusp. But maybe a change of scenery will do him good. Al Harrington is good but he's a little overrated, his trade value might have slipped had the pacers waited longer.
I'm sorry to see these guys go but I understand why Warriors made the deal. Murphy is a solid 'bounder and a 16ppg guy but will never be a banger inside which is what you need in a 4 (especially with Biedrins at 5). Check his man's stats nightly and you'll see he doesn't play man D either. Dunleavy is anything but 'horrible'. He's a very good complimentary player who can score, pass and rebound well for a 3. Problem here was being #4 scoring option behind JR, Baron and Murphy in old schemes.Ike has heart/talent but is just badly undersized at both 4 and 5. Harrington looks good and Warriors need depth right now with versatile Jackson and solid Sarunas. Comments about freeing up salary for impressive young players are right on. Indiana gets rid of troubled player and improves with three talented guys. Good for both teams.
Everyone keeps saying GS got the better of the trade but to me AHarrington is overrated I dont see him as a difference maker and apparently neither did the Hawks or Pacers. I think Indiana came out ahead cuz now they have the low post offense threat in O'neal, 3 very good rebounders in Foster, Diogu & Murphy who can step out and hit the open J. They also got Dunleavy who maybe did not leave up to GS expectations being the 3rd pick but he has not been a total bust he does nothing great but alot of things good and can probably play 2 or 3 positions... If he is ever going to flourish in the NBA I think Larry Bird is the person who cant help him. Indiana got more talent in this trade in my honest opinion if those 3 learn there roles I think Indiana improved greatly. And just to make it clear I dont really care about either team!
It always happens...sprewell, webber, hardaway, etc...now Dunleavy. He will do well in the pacer system probably upping his average to 20+ points a game. As far as for the other warriors...including Ike...garbage. Warriors get on worth anything on Harrington and well see how that unfolds with him having to keep his mouth shut and listen to Nellie every step of the way..SF
Murphy is a lead foot who plays horrible defense and has the worst +/- of anyone on the team. He will be slightly better in Carlisle's system, helping stretch the D for JO, but no NBA player really wants to play this game and the rules no longer support this style of BB. Dunleavy is soft. Diogu will always be undersized and slightly slow. He can be a good solid player if he learns how to pass. Harrington will thrive for Nellie.The best player by far in this trade. Jackson gets a chance or gets waived. Sarunas...well W's fans had one before and loved him. He'll give the W's a solid Baron backup and get him some rest. Warriors reduce long term deals and win this trade easily.
Hands down the Warriors got the better end of the deal. The Warriors were pretty strong in the back court. Now they've improved their front court tremendously. Indy fans might not know this, but Murphy and Dunleavy are due a combined $79.8M through 2010-2011. That's for two guys that couldn't break the starting lineup with the Warriors. Kelenna Azubuike, a D-league call up, was getting more playing time than Dunleavy! Why? Because Dunleavy doesn't take advantage of mismatches! He'll have a 6 ft pt. guard on him and he'll do a fade away shot instead of going strong to the hole!
This is a terrible trade anyway you look at it! Pacers are now jammed with big men with O'Neil, Diogu, Foster, Harrison, while missing a starting shooting guard and a good backup point guard. Warriors are now jammed with guards and small forwards and have no good big men underneath... I see more trades coming for both teams otherwise they will both suffer!
Everything is not always about star potential and statistics. As a diehard Pacers fan, I think one of our main problems was that we had too many players who were focused on their statline. If you look at the championship teams, they had players who may not have been headliners in the papers, but their intangible value and ability to embrace their role was the glue of those franchises. The Chicago Bulls are the poster franchise for this. So while we may have given up more stat-for-stat talent, I think the intangible things, and improved on-court chemistry swings this deal in the Pacers favor. When Al starts forcing crazy shots, and Jackson starts glaring at Nellie, you'll understand the importance of these intangibles. This was just a better fit, and I think our on-court flow will be so much better than it was.
I'm so happy to get rid of the dead weight on the Warriors called DunMurphy, and get back 2 players who fit the Nellie-ball system. I'll be sorry to see Ike Diogu go, I hope he becomes a beast in the East. But he didn't fit Nellie-ball.
Folks, if you think deeper, you'll see what the Pacers are trying to accomplish.
Murphy is half a season removed from being a 15 10 rebounding machine. There's already been rumors about the Pacers aiming to get Maggette using Dunleavy.
Diogu is going to be good, there's not doubt about that. In a few years the Warriors are going to realize what kind of talent they gave up.
Warriors fixed themselves in the short term. Harrington is a star, but it's obvious he's not all star caliber, otherwise he'd carried the hawks like Joe Johnson by now. Jackson got problems off the court, and who knows if he'll influence the other players negatively. Sauras is good, but he's not Diogu.
Short term the Warriors got the better end of the trade. If the Pacers manage to get maggette with Dunleavy, and after Diogu matures, the Pacers will get the better end of the deal. Murphy's a good player - I don't understand why people dislike him so much when he just averaged double doubles in his last 2 seasons.
Anyone who says Dunleavy can shoot obviously hasn't watch him play over the last 4 years. No shot, no heart but does have some other skills. Contract was atrocious and Mullin salvaged his job by getting rid of him and Murphy. Murphy is another good role player but for the $$$ he's making, he is simply not worth it. Ike is undersized but can develop into something decent. Warriors win simply b/c they got rid of 2 horrendous contracts without having to trade their best young players - Biedrins and Ellis.
Harrington will be fun to watch with the Warriors but he is slightly overrated.
If Jackson acts up, he's gone.
Not sure what Indiana was doing - they could have gotten rid of Jackson w/o taking on 2 of the worst contracts in the NBA.
Anybody read boxscores? I haven't for the Warriors, but it seems with the minutes Murphy and Dunleavy get, they seem to be productive. Check out Harrington and Jackson - lots of minutes, and very sporadic scoring and for Harrington, rebounds as well. Typical Jackson stat line: 33 minutes, 4-14 shooting, 2 boards, 1 assist, 4 turnovers. Harrington will look like a superstar one game, then VERY quite for a few games in a row. Granted, much of it could be Carlise's system, but maybe not. Can you spell TEAM? The Pacers had to shake it up - as did GS - I'm looking forward to the next few weeks (and heck, at least we're taking some interest!).