Getting jumpy about jingoism

SEOUL -- Thanks for your numerous responses to my article on nationalism at the World Cup. Here’s a few samples of your thoughts and feelings.

I am very sad to find that you think the German press is in the same “jingoism” as its neighbours. I have to say that the German press has very much surpised me during this tournament. Even the tabloids have not taken to anything but some cheesy encouragements. And if Germany is to fall out of the tournament we are all the more likely to crucify our own players and our coach than “jingo” the other country, as we have done in 1994, 1998 and 2000. German press has become quite sensitive since we are a democratic nation, and I would hope that you keep this in mind.”
--Sebastian Kempkens Cologne, Germany

I didn’t brand everyone, Sebastian. I just suggested that if my language skills were better I might have found similar examples of the attitude I was discussing in the media and comments from other countries. If the Germans are not guilty all credit to them.

Regarding your comments on nationalistic jingoism, I agree it can get ugly, especially when any two nations are locked in a bitter rivalry. However, you must also agree that it’s MUCH MUCH better to play on the football pitch than to slug it out on the battlefield? Adding to that, I was extremely disappointed with the Italian response to their defeat. I thought it was childish, immature and pure sour grapes. What are your thoughts?
-- Barry Choi from Seoul, South Korea

I agree it’s much better to slug it out on the pitch than in the trenches. But the point I was making is that it would be preferable if one was not a substitute for the other. You know -- get back to the essence of the game, which is spirited athletic competition, not bitter flag waving. The reaction of the Italian team and coaches to some dodgy officiating was understandable. The reaction of the Perugia coach was puerile.

I regret having to say this but I think your article on soccer jingoism is much like a breaking news story about the sun rising in the morning. Soccer IS jingoism. Any honest look at the game will show that it really promotes the worst of behavior in people. I keep hearing this nonsense about how Americans need to more appreciate soccer so that they better understand the world. But the type of violence and thuggery in world soccer is, strangely enough, shocking to many Americans. More understanding and appreciation of soccer won’t lead Americans to be more understanding of other cultures. I honestly fear it would lead them to be more xenophobic. The type of behavior I regularly see associated with world soccer is the type of behavior that is far worse than the worst qualities attributed to American travelers who venture beyond our borders. It’s not a pretty game and I don’t really think it ever has been. The fact that some people think a greater appreciation of soccer on the part of Americans will somehow lead to a more peaceful and understanding world just shows how dangerously clueless some people are. People often talk about how jingoistic, proud, nationalistic, and patronizing Americans can be towards other cultures. It doesn’t take much observing of world soccer to see that Americans are role models for the world. How many embassies in Washington, DC, feel they may have to shut down operations the day after their team has a victory over the US? It happened in Mexico just a few days ago and it will happen in other places. Let’s hope soccer isn’t too contagious.
-- James Kielland, Seattle USA

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The sun rose today? A rather long winded way of saying you don’t like soccer, wasn’t it, James? Strange as it may seem, the whole world isn’t waiting for the USA to embrace the most popular team game on the planet. I’ve been with the U.S team all tournament, America WANTS to be taken seriously on the soccer field, and succesfully played like their lives depended on it to achieve that goal. Americans are shocked by the violence of soccer, when every other news story on your local bulletins seems to be about violent crime? Please! Look, I know you can’t take nationalism out of international sport, whatever country you’re from. In some ways it adds to the fun. But using sport as an indication of one country’s inherent inferiority/superiority over another is just plane dumb, and, in a perfect world, the game would have no part of it.

I just read your article about jingoism and nationalism in the World Cup. Don't you think it's good that there is a sport in which one can be proud to be of their country, and wave their flag and paint their face and such? I think its healthy and i think we need MORE of it.
-- Ray Dillin Temple Texas USA

You’ve highlighted all the fun stuff about supporting your country’s team though. Which is great. Some of the comments I’ve refered too however, could be construed as a lot more offensive than a few candy striped faces and a chorus of “We are the Champions”.

Not a question, more of an observation. I too have been wondering why all the fanatical nationalism consuming the World Cup. I wholeheartedly agree with your piece concerning the jingoism that has taken over the games. I’m particularly disheartened by the Koreans and Italians. In what is supposed to be a classy sport, these two teams, and their respective fans, have sunken to new levels of fanaticism, and in doing so have tarnished the games. Such a pity.
-- Michael Brogan, stationed in Japan

Thanks for your support, Michael. I don’t know about singling out the Koreans and Italians though. That’s your opinion not mine. But I agree that fanaticism gone mad is an ugly thing to behold.

Never fear, Mr. Baddoo, for I’m sure that the US will unfortunately retain the heavyweight title for irrational jingoism when it comes to international sport, regardless of the outcome of the World Cup.
-- Jason Chappell, NYC, USA

I didn’t say that, he did.

I like your column, but feel that you unfairly singled out soccer and its hotbed nations (including my nation, Mexico) as a source of nationalism in sports. Truly, the US and the former USSR were most responsible for developing this nationalistic jingoism that Hitler started in Berlin. It has manifested itself throughout every Olympics, the most notable examples being the 1972 Munich basketball tournament (HBO still airs a documentary about the players that were “robbed of their gold medal), the recent display of the WTC flag in the olympic parade in Utah (along with the smug “USA” chants), and the choice of the US Olympic hockey team, who won a highly politicized match against the former USSR as the torch-bearers in this travesty of an example of goodwill and politics-free sport that were the Salt Lake City Olympics. My question for you then, is: whatever DID happen to gracious winners and good losers?
-- Ricardo Garza-Grande Ann Arbor, MI. ISA

I guess they got agents, sponsors, and supemodel girlfriends and decided that adhering to the ethics of sport, is beneath them. The reason I spoke about soccer is because this is a World Cup column, not an Olympic column.

You are upset because there is too much nationalism at the World Cup, but isn’t that what it is all about? Teams from around the world participate in the one sport that everyone around plays. I love that when a country wins a World Cup game that the streets become deadlocked with celebrating fans and that there are riots when they lose. That is what the Cup is all about... national pride. It is a shame that the U.S. citizens can’t show the same amount of passion.
-- Phillip Walsky, Falmouth, VA USA

But what you’ve described ain’t jingoism, as I explain elsewhere in this mailbag. And why is it that even some of its own citizens want to keep dogging the USA?

The headline “Korea make history, Japan just history” may not be original for Korea Herald. You can find the same line at Fifaworldcup official website. So much for FIFA’s unbalanced gratitude toward one of host countries. I understand that you thought historical Korea-Japan relation is a great fit to your football jingoism story. However your idea was little bit far fetched.
-- Ukyo Jeong Boston, USA

Oh, so if I find an example that exactly emphasises my point I’m reaching am I? Look, it doesn’t really matter who originated that particular headline, the Korean papers used it, and it’s out in the public domain. So the potential effect is the same.

Sour taste? For once we have a true international flavor to a sport. Ever been a Yankee fan in Boston? Are you looking for reasons not to support the only truly international sport? How about Steinbrenner and his attitude regarding the need to win? Down on baseball too? Give the tournament it’s due. The World Cup is really just that. Along with it you must have emotional moments, otherwise it would not be a sport competition would it? Remember the Olympics? Does that mean there is a jingoism in the sport of speedskating too? -- Neil Novesky, Cornwall, NY USA

That would be a yes.

Terry, I agree with you, much as I love football, it does leave sour taste to see sport mixed with politic and it sad that this beautiful sport come to this stage! Don’t expect the fans to treat this as a sport, where loser and winner is the only outcome, if the politician, president of sport club, the newspaper editor treat it as a political battle in which national pride must win over sportmanship.
-- Cat Ctoke Malaysia

Well said.

Terry, interesting article. I have long thought that there is way too much jingoism in American pro sports. MLB calls its championship the “World Series” and virtually every other American professional sports championship calls itself a “world championship.” But they aren’t competing against the world, it’s strictly a national professional league competing against itself. Don’t point the finger at the World Cup only, jingoism is probably worse in US sports.
-- Todd Coleman Vancouver, Canada

“I too am very uncomfortable with the degree of negative nationalism present at the World Cup. But the manner in which many international sporting events are conducted seems to aggravate this problem. Every time I watch the Olympics, for example, I get quite uneasy about the level of flag-waving and anthem playing that is cheerfully rammed down our throats after each and every event. Let’s count those medals carefully now; God forbid that the Germans should get more than us. Are the Koreans appreciating the irony of their present position? After complaining vociferously about speed skating injustice, to the point where their footballers are mimicking skaters, they now find themselves on the other side of the ledger, being part of some international conspiracy to defraud Italy. It’s really getting all too absurd. The loss of perspective is appalling. Football, like all sport, is supposed to be fun. Sure, losing is momentarily painful, but losing is something that goes along with participating. The World Cup is a fabulous opportunity for people from different cultures across the globe to come together in friendship and enjoy the world’s most popular sport played at its highest level. To drown this in jingoistic fervor is an enormous waste.
-- Steven Eeakman, Seattle USA

Great point. So I’m not alone.

Once again the fool speaks out, dont u realize the history of Japan and Korea, oops i forgot only ignorant people don’t know that, and what a coincidence, youre ignorant. What about the U.S. celebrations, you think countries like to see the U.S. celebrate as if they were always good at soccer cosidering our economic and social state compared to the others. God man people like u just keep criticising, i dont get it. If any couuntry in the world cup has reason to gloat, it’s KOREA no one gave them a chance, i surely didn’t, im a fan of european soccer all the way. I dont care about KOREA’s team but hey theyve earned this to the fullest. Not the U.S. We lucked out so easily playing Mexico and Korea is the only reason why we are here. So i hope u root for the States cause it’s gonna be 4-0 DeutschLAnd.
-- Chris AHn L.A. USA

From one apparent idiot to another, may I explain that had you read the article properly you would have realized that it’s precisely because I do know some of the history between South Korea and Japan that I found the apparent gloating in the Korean media article I mentioned distasteful. Had you not been so keen to put the boot in you might have understood that it’s the blatant entry of politics into an ostensibly sporting event that I object to. I know it’s always gone on, and I know I could have cited incidents at other sporting events where the USA has been equally guilty. But I was talking about football/soccer, and this World Cup, where the U.S, in my view, has been innocent. My job in this column is to raise topics for debate, and occasionally, though not in this case, to play Devil’s advocate. Judging by the amount of response I received on this issue I’d say I’ve done my job pretty well, wouldn’t you? Incidentally, the success of one team, Korea, doesn’t necessarily diminish the achievements of another, the USA, unless they’re playing head-to-head of course. Plus, every good team needs its share of luck. Granted, the USA rode theirs to an extent, but I hope the Americans' incredible performance in the quarterfinals, in which they pushed three-time champion, Germany, to the limit, has at least made you show some respect for the great strides made by U.S soccer.

Are you nuts? Jingoism is the BIG reason for soccer fever. That’s what makes it so orgasmic, it’s the only forum where people can boo and diss other countries. It’s WAR man, and jingoism is the ONLY rule!!
-- Darryl Gordon

Am I nuts???? Trust me, I know people who’ve been into battle for their country, and football is nothing like war. The point you’re missing is that patriotism and jingoism are two different things. The former, is a healthy support for your country and its achievements. The latter is an extreme kind nationalism that verges on the rabid. Support your country to the hilt by all means, but when you start associating victory in a football match with having a superior culture you’re in trouble. And, if you find football “orgasmic” I guess you’ve got troubles enough already.

You forgot to mention Ahn’s uncalled for speed skater celebration in the list of “accolades.” Maybe someone should tell him that Americans didn’t judge the Olympics and that no one in the U.S. even knew what short track speed skating was until the Koreans caused such a fuss about it. But they got it right this time, they stole an event that someone actually cares about.
-- Seth Flanagan Sao Paulo Brasil

Like you, Seth, I just thought Ahn’s speedskating celebration was tacky. I didn’t see it as offensive, and certainly not a dig at the national character of the USA. Furthermore, how many people actually got the reference to the Winter Olympic controversy anyway? That wasn’t nationalism, in my view, it was just some silly playground tit for tat. But, of course, it’s all in the eye of the beholder.

Your apparent lack of American patriotism, as is the case with any American, does not give you rights to consider a nation united as ‘jingoistic’. Don’t use words you don’t understand. Yes, the world cup is a soccer contest but countries such as the Koreas and the Japans are still looking for avenues to get out of the dark. They have worked too hard over the years, through much technological, industrial, social and political advances to have an ignorant guy like yourself consider a nation united under one objective as excessive. You leave the sour taste in my mouths.
-- James Han, Chicago

Questionable comment number one -- I have no right to be patriotic about the USA, as I am English. I assume you’re not a regular viewer of World Sport? Either that, or you are so unwordly that you can’t tell one accent from another. Questionable comment number two -- I’m sure the South Koreans and Japanese would be delighted to hear that with the centuries of rich cultural history with which their respective nations are blessed, they need football to bring them out of the dark. Questionable point number three -- I don’t believe you understand the difference between patriotism and jingoism. See my interpretation in a previous answer, and by all means write to me again. And the final questionable point -- "sour taste in my mouths”? I know where one of your mouths is, but where’s the other?

Gracious winners and good losers? Are you kidding me? This is war! And you Terry, citizen of the Hooligan Nation, should know this better than anyone! I mean you have people tearing down the city over league matches in England so what did you expect will happen when four years of national expectation finally makes its way onto the field. You will get 90 minutes of warfare. And then you have the post-match celebration/depression. Enjoy it while it lasts... it won’t happen again for four years.
-- Shujah, Boston

Fair point on the hooliganism, Shujah. Though FIFA has just praised the England fans for their behavior at this World Cup, so we’re not all bad. In fact, most of the English fans are not bad at all. In truth the majority do not warrant or enjoy the “Hooligan Nation” tag. On the other issue, while I don’t regard sport as anything akin to actual warfare, I agree that each nation/team engages in 90-minutes of combat on the pitch. It’s all the garbage that comes before and after that I took issue with.

World Cup jingoism leaves a sour taste, your article was absolutely fabulous. What will happen next to Landon Donavan if USA Beats Germany, the German league won’t honor him? As in Italy’s case, I love Italy but to fire Ahn was a mistake, why should Ahn go ahead and kicks goals for Italy? It is absurd.
-- Chris Veerabadran, Raleigh, NC

Thanks for your support. Chris. As you now know, the USA didn’t quite manage to upset Germany, so its impact on Donovan’s career is a moot point. That said, I spoke with US coach, Bruce Arena, after the game, and he was under the impression that Landon will be going back to Bayer Laverkusen. The player himself though hinted that he might like to stay in the MLS. As for Perugia’s treatment of Ahn, well I just think the chairman has made the club a laughing stock. I personally doubt any other club is likely to Perugia’s lead, and if it does, I doubt it would be quite so public about the reason behind the decision.

Terry, I liked the column on your uneasiness with World Cup nationalism. Your question “Whatever happened to gracious winners and good losers?” is easy to answer. We haven’t lost yet. Japan has and I think you will see the class of the Japanese population as they cheer for other nations. Korea, should they lose, will likely do the same. I don’t expect Mexico to root for us, though I have no doubt that we would be pulling for them against Germany. Some nations get it, others don’t.
-- Chris Oler, Chicago, IL

It is interesting to note that you totally fail to mention the jingoism paraded by Americans in all international sporting events. Maybe the only reason why it isn’t so noticeable (although it undoubtedly is present) in this World Cup is the lack of interest in the sport? Is it too much to ask for a bit less partisanship from an American?
-- Pim, England

I don’t know, I’m not one. Now, when people from outside my homeland fail to recognize my accent, I can deal with it. But, apparently you live in England. And whether you are British or not, you must recognize my accent as English. Of course, if you’ve never watched the show, World Sport, you wouldn’t know. But I do think you might have checked rather than base your entire argument on the perceived traits of a nationality that is not mine.

Why are you such a pansy? This is the World Cup. When two rival sports teams in the States play, sports commentators write similar headlines trashing other cities and their constituents. Here, it’s nations playing nations. Just because there’s smack-talking between nations concerning a game doesn’t mean there’s going to be war. It’s the last vestige of full-on nationalism. And don’t give me that “what about the Olympics?” crap. Grow some balls or don’t cover the Cup.
-- John Dowlin, Chicago

"Pansy”. “Grow some balls”. Your first and last statements show where you’re coming from better than any of the claptrap in between. And if you’re comfortable with your black and white macho man view of the issue, I’m not about to waste my time trying to make you read the small print. By the way, just because it exists doesn’t make it a good thing. And just because it happens in the States, doesn’t make it desirable.

And with that I must return to the arduous task of watching football. Until next time, enjoy the World Cup.

Terry Baddoo is co-host of World Sport, the international sports show that airs live on CNN International. He will regularly contribute Postcards from South Korea to CNNSI.com during the World Cup.

 

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